Sheree 0:00
All right, super excited for today, we're gonna do something a little bit different. Rather than just discussing a specific topic, we thought we might try out bringing in a case study. So both Krista and I work with clients on a one to one basis, and different group capacities, all that sort of thing. And we get clients that come in, and we start to see these patterns in these trends. And so the client we're using today is one that came to me, with an IBS, chronic IBS diagnosis, she had tried so many different diets, as we've all tend to typically FODMAP is the go to hadn't really seen much progress, lots of gas, lots of bloating, or regular bowel movements to both spectrums. So she was kind of moving from lots of constipation to lots of loose bowel movements, sometimes it'd be normal, and she didn't really know what was going on. And so the biggest thing I think, I always stress when it comes to my clients is you want to get to the root cause. And I know Chris is exactly the same. And so with her work, she implemented a functional medicine tests a comprehensive stool analysis. And to get to the bottom of this, because when it comes to IBS, to me, that's a very blanket diagnosis, there's something deeper going on. And we want to we want to get to the bottom of that.
Christa 1:11
Yeah, this is gonna be a good one, because I would say most of my clients have some spectrum of gut discomfort, some are more extreme than others. But you know, with the standard American diet, at least, and the amount of stress that we have, there's a lot of things that play a role in this. But IBS is kind of Yeah, like you said, it's a very blanket statement without a lot of answers. And I agree, like you can have a diagnosis, but what is the root cause of like, where did what's the upstream reasons that now this person is really suffering in their day to day with, you know, high food sensitivities, or they can eat something because they know they're gonna get bloated. I mean, that's really frustrating, that's a really frustrating place to be. Or if you have very unpredictable, like you're out and about, and all of a sudden your stomach is like, we are ready to go to the bathroom. Like it's really, really, really frustrating. And not to mention, the toxicity problems that we have is particularly in women with constipation, like, you know, going to the bathroom is one of the main ways that we get rid of hormones and other toxins. And if you are going days on end, without pooping, that is a problem. That's a big problem. Huge problem. So I mean, that causes all sorts of other issues that you may not even relate to it far beyond just feeling uncomfortable in your belly. Like there's a lot going on. So yeah, I can't wait to do this, let's dive into some of the specifics around this case study of this particular claim that you have. Yeah,
Sheree 2:44
so we, like I said, we started off with a stool test, she'd done so much work already. And that's what I typically find, I know that that's what you typically find as well, a lot of people have done their own research, they potentially worked with other practitioners. And they're just still not seeing the progress. And just as a bit of like, you know, put this out there. But FODMAP is something you're not really supposed to be on for very long. And it tends to be what the doctors will prescribe IBS, because they can't find the other solution for it. Let's just put you on a FODMAP diet. And so people get stuck with this FODMAP diet, and they're on it for years. And it's so so I can't remember what they all stand for. But like for disaccharides, oligosaccharides disaccharides. And an MIP stands for a bunch of things, all of them are typically carbohydrate based. And what those are known to do is ferment a lot more in the gut, which can cause more gas cause more bloating, and so people often see a massive relief and symptoms, or symptomology of IBS, because they've taken those out. So this may be things like broccoli, cauliflower, apples, like whole real nutritious foods that actually provide us with so many nutrients that our bodies need. Yet, you know, things like the broccoli in the cauliflower cruciferous vegetables, which helps support estrogen detoxification. And so if you've got someone on a long term FODMAP diet and taking out these beautiful, nourishing Whole Foods, they're actually going to be doing more damage in the long term. You know, a lot of the research supports, you shouldn't really be on a low FODMAP diet for anything longer than six weeks, and then you start to reintroduce, but the issue with that is yes, it can be supportive. Don't get me wrong, like there is a place for it. But it's not really addressing the root cause. And so when we got this client still result back, we saw that her inflammatory markers were quite low, but she did have high levels of Zonulin, which is a marker of like leaky gut, how spread out that gut wall is how leaky the gut is and she had lots of food intolerances as well. So it made sense, right? And the FODMAP had kind of given her some relief, but then didn't really the other thing that came back was she did have a bacterial overgrowth, and this was I'm gonna say the name wrong I'm very so it's a big thing. It's like Citrobacter for noodley but it Anyway, that's probably
Christa 5:01
bacteria words or
Sheree 5:05
blog with me, as I said, long, long story short, she had an overgrowth and you know, again, a lot of the research supports that with IBS, around 84% of cases 84% IBS cases, actually just undiagnosed SIBO. So SIBO, small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, we also have SIBO, which is small intestinal fungal overgrowth. So you can see even just from that, if we were to the most people will look a little bit deeper than IBS. And look at SIBO 84% of people would be far better off because we can actually treat SIBO we're not just giving you this FODMAP diet and saying good luck, you're on your merry way.
Christa 5:42
Yeah, yeah, I've had a lot of clients similar to this, where they just are not getting relief, or if they've had this for years. And there is something you know, if you've had food poisoning, there is I can't remember the exact percentage. But if you've had food poisoning, there's a very high chance that you'll have small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, because whatever bacteria made you sick tends to have, you know, an over overgrowth. When we talk about COVID vaccine, maybe you've had epstein barr, mono, these things are difficult for the body, you know, it's a big hit to the body's immune system. Anytime you've had a big illness virus like that, it really does affect the body's immune system to regulate some of this bacterial overgrowth. And when we have a lot of extra overgrowth in the large intestine, then oftentimes, we will see some of that start to grow in the small intestine. And, you know, back to, you know, update everybody on biology or anatomy, our small intestine isn't meant to have a lot of bacteria in it, because we're still we still have a lot of unprocessed food there, right? So that's where we don't want a high amount of bacteria. Because right there is where we're absorbing fluids and things like that. And the bulk of the bacterial breakdown of foods happens in the large intestine. So you can imagine if there's bacteria that love, you know, want to break down food, it's a lot of gas in your small intestine, which explains a lot of that bloating shortly after eating a meal, because it's in the small intestine, bacteria having a heyday really uncomfortable.
Sheree 7:18
Yeah, you know, if we're thinking about that constipation picture to have the food kind of sitting there, and it has that transfer command, and then the bugs, you know, you're not really beating the other bugs that are living in the large intestine, it's almost like they get hungry, and they go looking for food elsewhere. And they almost that's, you know, the way I explain it to clients is they kind of climb into the small intestine, looking for more food. And that's where that bacteria tends to start to colonize and develop more of an issue of long run, but and then they start to crave again, very much, like we talked about, in another episode, that sugar or they give you those other other symptoms and feelings as well. But even starting to affect our mental health can be a big one when it comes to SIBO, too.
Christa 7:57
Yeah, I think it's important to point out, you know, as the client, as a person walking around with IBS, all you're focused on mainly is the discomfort I mean, they're constipation, bloating, or let's, you know, diarrhea, but literally, when you take apart those things, it goes beyond the gut, like you said, like it goes beyond. So if someone's experiencing frequent diarrhea, you're really not allowing the body to absorb nutrients appropriately. So that's when we can find a lot of vitamin and mineral deficiency, which, you know, like you said, can lead to anemia, as it can lead to depression, it can lead to all sorts of things that really originate from fast transit time. And there are some bacteria that really promote faster irritability of the gut. And so you have the diarrhea, and then like we said, Before, the constipation, then you feel that physical discomfort in your in your gut, but what's really happening is now you've got weight gain, and you've got estrogen dominance, so you're putting yourself at higher risk for estrogen related issues. And so it goes beyond the gut. So it's really important to recognize that this is an issue that and also that it's something that can be solved. So what are some of the things that you do outside of maybe testing if people don't have access directly to testing? What are some things that you do with your clients?
Sheree 9:10
Well, one of the biggest things I do because we know like sugar can feed those bad bugs, those that overgrowth, I tend to go down more of a paleo esque approach. So I will start with modifying the diet and limiting carbohydrates. That's not to say that carbohydrates are bad, we need carbohydrates. Carbohydrates are really good to nourish our good bacteria as well, but keeping them all to a limitation, and that will encourage that starvation type situation to go on. So there's bugs aren't feeding on this quick release carbohydrates, or any carbohydrates for that matter, you know, because a lot of the times the body can still feed on even ones that take a little bit slower to process or break down. So it's keeping them to a minimum but not completely eliminating them because they do serve a purpose, right? Everything serves a purpose. And so that would be one one route or one avenue. The other route is if they have an If they haven't had tested, but if they have had testing, I will quite often pop in antimicrobial treatments. So you know, we're looking at different herbs that are specific to the bacteria that's shown up and going in with a kill agents to actually mitigate and wipe that one out. And that's normally a bit of a process, right, we're looking at probably about three months, 12 weeks of treatment, to actually make sure that we are eradicating that with breaks in between, because we can't stay on antimicrobials for a full 12 week length of time. But the other thing I do, regardless of whether or not they've been tested, but they're presenting with their symptoms is actually makes sure people have got a good probiotic going in. Because that serves for a lot of reasons. Firstly, and you touched on this earlier, our stress levels are so high in the modern society now. And that impacts our gut function massively. So not only are we potentially encouraging an overgrowth, with some of the reasons we've mentioned earlier, we tend to have lower and lower and lower levels of that good bacteria through stress your inflammation through at you know, catching a virus or a food intolerance or antibiotic use, whatever it is that's caused that. And so quite often, we need to top up and when there's enough or an abundance of this good bacteria, these probiotics, they can also start to crowd out some of those bad ones as well. So it starts to bring a little bit more balance into the ecosystem that is our gut. Yes,
Christa 11:22
probiotics, for sure. I think it can be confusing sometimes which probiotic because certainly with SIBO, you know, if the bacteria is kind of settling in, some people can have a lot of bloating, a lot of discomfort right off the bat with probiotics. So you know, there's not a one size fits all what I found, there's not a one size fits all probiotic, I tend to go to spore based and spore based doesn't need to be refrigerated, they tend to not really flourish until they're in the large intestine environment. And so that's helpful. A lot of times, sometimes I'll look for probiotics that have no yeast at all, because, you know, we suspect maybe a yeast overgrowth is causing that. So it's important, you know, if you're having trouble with one probiotic to not lose hope, like sometimes you just need a different combination of probiotics until you find the one that you can tolerate. And that's really starting to simmer down your symptoms. I definitely agree with the antimicrobial herbs, there are the options to have antibiotics. But as we know, prescription antibiotics also eradicate some of the bacteria that we really want. And so antimicrobial herbs like oil of oregano Berberine, sometimes those can just be enough, I do recommend if you're on the trend to testing, you have the capability to do a whole round and then test within two weeks to see if you need another round. Because sometimes it can be really frustrating because it can come back. And that's where it's important that I have found to look even further upstream of what is actually causing this and you mentioned stress. And let me I'll remind you that stress puts us in that fight or flight mode, not rest and digest. So if we're living in a very stressful job environment, or a very stressful relationship, or whatever the stress is, there can be a propensity for our gut to really take a hit because we're in that firefight. So we're not moving, we're not digesting food as well. Maybe we're eating too fast. Because we're rushed. We're not allowing that good strong stomach acid to really release which helps to immediately kill off some bacteria that we're eating. So stress can be a definite upstream and can cause that reoccurrence. I like when people dive into vagal stimulation, maybe you know, breathwork vagal stimulation like gargling or singing really loud, I mean, turn up the volume in the car by yourself, right? Because that does stimulate the vagus nerve, the vagus nerve really can tell the gut to get into that rest and digest right. So managing some of our lifestyle stress and chewing our food appropriately not over diluting with fluids when we're eating our meals. Those are all some lifestyle things that we can start to incorporate the other things that I find as far as lifestyle goes is going a little bit longer between meals. Because we don't want to constantly be feeding we want to eat, allow the body to move and move these you know the food out about four hours. If you're struggling with SIBO, I would say longer maybe intermittent fasting could be something for you at least 12 to 14 hours, most of that being overnight, but then also during the day spreading out about four hours. Because if you're struggling with that the grazing does not work. Well. The bacteria is just constantly being fed. There's like no servation period for these bacteria that are just having a heyday in your small intestine. So spreading out meals a little bit and holding true to the four hour mark I think is helpful too.
Sheree 14:47
Yeah. And that's Yeah, that's so true. Because the gut needs that time. That means that break to actually process the food. So just the food and again, if you've got that SIBO pitcher, we don't constantly be feeding them. The other thing that a lot of the research supports in, that's coming to light quite as of reasons. As we, as you know, we have microbiomes everywhere, right? We've all got microbiome, we have a vaginal microbiome, we even have an oral microbiome. And so like you said, it's almost like a top down approach. Yes, there's the vagal nerve stimulation and the stress and that, but sometimes it's even we've got a whole bunch of bacteria in our mouth. And that's directly linked to our gut microbiome. And so something that's come to light that I've started implementing the past few months, six or seven months now with my clients is oil pulling. And so you can grab, you know, some coconut oil, swirl it around in your mouth, and you do this while you're still taking your antimicrobials. Now, coconut oil is amazing, because it already has antimicrobial, anti bacterial antifungal properties, but it's it sweeps in through the mouth, it starts to really support that clearance of the oral microbiome, you need to do it for about 10 to 15 minutes every day, it's not the most pleasant thing to do, when you first get started, I will say that I've done it personally. But that really supports in making sure that you are clearing it not just in your gut, but in other areas of your body as well. And you make sure you spit it out. And it's not you're not swallowing it or anything like that. So that also supports that clearance of those bedbugs too, because we can be getting them from everywhere, right? We like you said have some also have a stomach acid, we may not have enough stomach acid or a high quality stomach acid or at the right pH for us even be killing off those bacteria. So they may bypass them out, go into the stomach and then end up in the small intestine that way as well.
Christa 16:28
Yeah, so some things that outside of testing, like, let's just say that, you know, you've got some of these symptoms, and you suspect, okay, I'm constipated all the time, or my stomach is so erratic, I don't know what to expect every day. A good place to start is digestive enzymes and things that I look for in a digestive enzyme. Unless you've got stomach ulcers, you want to avoid anything that says HCl in it. That's the stomach acid. But outside of having stomach ulcers, I would definitely get a digestive enzyme that gives you a little boost in HCl, which is the stomach acid, also something that contains ox bile, because that really helps kind of augment your bile, which is an anti microbial naturally in your body. And then also something like lipase, which helps to produce more enzymes to break down food. And then finally, something that has lactase in it, because a lot of people walk around that are lactose intolerant, and don't really know that they are. And so something that contains those four elements can be really, really helpful. Ideally, you take it about five minutes, 10 minutes before you eat, but if you remember in the middle of a meal, just pop it in and take it because digestive enzymes can be really, really helpful in food, nutrient absorption, and then also just breaking down the food and moving along quicker. 100 bucks. Yeah, the other thing that I recommend is something called a barrel gas. And I know in the US, you can get this on Amazon, I ve R O GA S T and that is it's been around for a very long time. But it can be really helpful when you have gas or you're constipated, it helps to move along, you know, move peristalsis it helps to move the intestine just super important. Because we don't want things sitting there, we need that movement to really shift bacteria. So it doesn't have it's kind of like a pond. We don't want the pond just sitting there, right? Because that's when bacteria can really have opportunity to grow. But it's the movement. It's like making it like a river, right? Like nothing really has long enough to sit there and become stagnant and overgrow. So if you're having issues with motility, that's a supplement that can be really helpful. Anything that contains ginger root can be really helpful. And at the end of any antimicrobial herbs, anything like that you really want to integrate some of these gingerroot barbaric as something along those lines, that helps us the intestines really move well for good solid three months post treatment, because we want to keep that got moving we want to river we do not want a stagnant pond. Yeah.
Sheree 18:57
And like you've said before that really if we stopped them antimicrobials and we don't put those in, then we are going to end up more likely or increasing the likelihood of that overgrowth occurring again, right, our body's already been predisposed to it. So we don't want to encourage any of that. That's where the oil polling comes in. That's where the prokinetics come in. Like you want to keep the body moving and moving regularly. And if you start to notice you're getting more of those symptoms coming back again, then it is really important to do what you can like even just chewing your food, the brain knows you're slowing down enough to chew your food. It gives the body enough time to prepare for digestion to make sure that those motor that motility that peristalsis that you talked about can actually be triggered and turned on rather than sitting at your desk eating and you're busy concentrating on something else or rush a and I used to eat in the car while I was driving and you're not even focused on the fact that you're chewing your food, or you've already pre loaded your next fork full of food before you've even swallowed the one that's in your mouth. It's like we need to be a lot more present when we're eating as well to support again, that movement and that rate Killer motility,
Christa 20:00
it really does. I mean, a lot of it does come back down to health foundations that seem really, really super boring and not sexy at all, like chew your food, like, on down in the mornings regulate your stress. I mean, it doesn't always require nor does a pill permanently fix any of these issues, we have to look upstream, we have to look at what caused it in the first place. And I think going back to some things that can predispose us to it like food poisoning, but then also inhalers. And I think you mentioned that a little bit with yeast overgrowth, people who have asthma, which by the way, low stomach acid has been correlated with asthma. So it's a really interesting connection there, that a lot of people that have asthma also have low stomach acid and so repairing that can can actually improve overall health. But if you had been using a an oral inhaler, even as a child, like let's say, You're in your early 20s, and as a child, you had a lot of asthma, you were doing a lot of inhalers or you were on steroids for asthma, whatever, you can have a yeast or a slow simmering yeast overgrowth. It's really just perpetually been there for a long time. And you know, as it progresses, as you become more aware of it, you're like, wow, I, you know, there's an issue here. And so sometimes this overgrowth can happen earlier on. So it's really important to kind of go through your Rolodex of your health and what you've been taking, not just the past year, but how was your childhood? How was the past 510 years of stress and medications and sicknesses? Yeah,
Sheree 21:26
like even ship has things I think it will serve some people like I went, I went to the doctor's for years, I actually ended up with eczema, my head, I used to scratch to the point where my nails or be blood under my nails. I'd wake up in the morning because I've been scratching so profusely through the night. I also had the ended up developing athletes, but so grow so much fun stuff, right with health. But when I went to the doctors, she was like, Oh, it's just a stress. It's a stress rash, or a stress itch. The Athlete's Foot is just athletes, but let me give you some anti fungals for it. And it kept reoccurring, it kept recurring. And at the time, I've been able to look back down knowing what I know, my parents had separated. So yes, the stress was massive. I was going through a divorce and there was so much going on my body had reacted to that I'd also had heaps of antibiotics prior to that. So I was only 12 years old at this time, right? So you're not thinking about what it's doing to your health or anything. But when I got to the age of my early 20s, and I was actually reflecting on my medical health history, and I was starting to go, why does this thing always like this itching in my head always reoccur? It was then that I figured out I had Candida and I'd had Candida as an overgrowth, for those last like 12 years, potentially, or 10 years when I started to investigate it further. So once you can, as much as you can get small intestinal bacterial overgrowth that can start to go systemic too, if you couple it with something like leaky gut. And so that's when you can start to see like I had issues in my head issues in my feet. Some people show up with eczema on their hands or their elbows like and that may not be fungal overgrowth, but it can also be related to something else that's going on in the gut. Yeah, for sure. I
Christa 23:00
mean, if you've got an overgrowth in your small intestine, you probably have an overgrowth in your large intestine. And yeah, like you said, it's a slippery slope. Now we've got inflammation all the time in our gut. Now we've got leaky gut, or that barrier has been exposed and our body is exposed to more that causes systemic inflammation. And so it to me, I love following the rabbit trail, because so much of what we think we're broken with, or I'll never get over this, like, if we just really take some steps back and look at the bigger picture like where's this upstream? Like, what's actually causing some of this, that's how we get real resolution to things like small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, where we're just so uncomfortable. And it's important to recognize that because we aren't, it's not just a one isolated thing, like our body is so interconnected. So if you have an issue there, it is causing other systemic issues. If not, now, it will later. So even if it's, you know, nutrient deficiencies, that that start to show up in other areas, or, you know, other areas that we consider a disease, right disease in our body originally started from something going on in the gut. So I love this case study. I think that a lot of people can relate to this on some degree, because it is so common, it's a really common thing. And it is workable, it is resolvable, it's just a matter of finding the source of it, resolving it once and for all, and then making some lifestyle lifestyle shifts that really help support your healing.
Sheree 24:22
Yeah, and that's exactly what we did. She has come out the other side and who gets happy, healthy, she's feeling amazing energies, better hormones, and are better periods more regular, like, the knock on effect is just phenomenal. And like you say, it's following that rabbit trail, healing it at the root, and then making sure you're sustaining it for life. And that doesn't mean you have to be on probiotics or antimicrobials or anything for the rest of your life. It's more making sure you've completely gotten rid of it completely eradicated and then you're doing things to support your overall health so that it doesn't come back. Amazing.
Christa 24:54
Thanks for sharing, and we will do more of these. I love case studies. They're super helpful. So if you like But let us know and we will put some more information in the show notes we'll see you next time bye
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